[00:00:34] Merry Christmas.
[00:00:36] I did put up the little Christmas
[00:00:39] Oh, look at us being so festive.
[00:00:41] It's after Thanksgiving.
[00:00:42] That is the saddest little
[00:00:44] I know I'm gonna redo it. I got it up there and I was like, oh,
[00:00:50] So this is gonna be our first time doing this, so kind. Don't really know what to expect. Are you nervous?
[00:00:57] Not really, no. I feel like I'm [00:01:00] prepared enough. I did make a little intro if you want me to
[00:01:04] Yeah, but first I'm trying to figure out what is on your laptop.
[00:01:10] Oh, okay. I thought that they were scissors,
[00:01:12] and my mouse is the black
[00:01:14] Do you think there's gonna be another movie?
[00:01:16] There's supposed to be a third one. Yeah.
[00:01:19] I wonder if it's gonna come out next
[00:01:21] I hope a lot of people didn't like the second one I did. Yeah. But when I watch Hocus Pocus, I pay attention to the witches and I could give two shits about, oh, the kids, oh no, it's let the witches wet. Even with this one, I was like, can they just win?
[00:01:39] Give me a movie, like Ma lent was almost where the villain wins. I want the Queen or the Evil Witch to just one
[00:01:48] Yeah, I did like that. I like the beginning where you learned a little bit about their background story and why they are the way they are. So I liked that part and like why they're so close. So you [00:02:00] start rooting for them.
[00:02:01] I love the witch mother to the gray-haired one and I love that she's the shame nun from Game of Thrones. Like just, she is such a pretty woman.
[00:02:12] That's funny. The only thing, I guess the only criticism I would have is, but with it being Disney, like they really have to write a line because they're trying to appeal to children, but also the original people who would've watched it, who are now adults.
[00:02:26] that's who like the people my age that have seen it, they say oh, it's very campy and there's too much singing. And I'm like, first it's Disney second it's Bet Midler. Like of course she's gonna sing it's Bet Midler for Christ's sakes. That's what she's famous for.
[00:02:44] I'm just thinking like we're all in this off topic, but it's Halloween, it's scary, and this is a mystery type of podcast. So I guess it does fall into our
[00:02:56] our topic,
[00:02:57] topics that we're gonna discuss. Which brings [00:03:00] us to the first topic, which is the one that you're gonna be covering, but what introduction did you
[00:03:04] Oh, I just had a little, you know me
[00:03:07] a little or are just people not enough. Sometimes you never know . But our new podcast is called Mystery Incorporated. So I love a good theme and I love to run with a good theme. So I started off a little, Hey gang, you like that? This is the maiden voyage of our new podcast, mystery Incorporated, the podcast where we will learn all about foul, rotten, and mysterious people, places, and things in our world.
[00:03:35] We are your host, my brother Shane Waters, the host of Foul Play. And I am Joshua Waters, the host of Roten to the Core, and a Queen with a fascination for the supernatural.
[00:03:49] You may have noticed. Like I said, we are brothers and our last name is Waters. And aside from our humor, we tend to be pretty opposite people, but [00:04:00] I am thrilled about this podcast and letting the world see a glimpse of our unique relationship.
[00:04:07] He is the best big brother a gay could ever ask for, and I am grateful that he is today. Oh, sorry,
[00:04:18] no. Go ahead. You can go ahead.
[00:04:20] Today we will be learning all about monsters, human, and mythological ones. For those who don't know us, Shane and I have ancestors who were early settlers of the Appalachian Mountains, living throughout several haulers in Virginia, Tennessee, and Kentucky.
[00:04:37] no. I think that's a good background and that the fact that you have that nicely prepared gives people a nice
[00:04:45] That was a
[00:04:46] all my
[00:04:47] yeah, you had that nice introduction and I had a nice introduction of, hi, I'm Shane
[00:04:55] just to s So you already off the bat, you can tell our differences.
[00:04:59] It reminds me of [00:05:00] growing up and having to share a room in your side of the room was always nice and neat and mine was not so nice and neat. And then you ab bribe me to make my room, my side of the room nice and neat.
[00:05:12] Eventually I just, I'm just gonna do it. Except
[00:05:16] the thing. I remember my side of the room always being clean.
[00:05:20] But the one thing still to this day, my closet is always some, you remember our closet in Mun
[00:05:25] open it. And what's funny is like we would. Our grandma would be like, go clean your room. And we'd, be cleaning deep, cleaning it, and our room would be spotless. It'd be perfect, but don't open that closet. You may not survive. If you open that, dear God, don't open that closet.
[00:05:45] And that's how both of us, I think, are to this day. Even the office here, it's like that. It's nice, neat. If you come in, everything's in its place. But if you open a drawer,
[00:05:57] Don't open no drawers. Look in. No [00:06:00] cubbies,
[00:06:00] No, we have stuff hit away in every little space
[00:06:05] I'm that way at home where I hate having stuff out in the open. I just like it to look pristine and But then I forget what stuff that I put away and I'm like, oh yeah, I bought new toothpaste. Like I'll just add it to the pile that I already have.
[00:06:22] Yeah, I do that too. But my problem is normally when I have something that takes batteries, I'll normally run, like that device will run out of batteries, I'll buy new batteries, but then I'll not remember where I put that device and it's stuffed away in a drawer somewhere. And then I'll have the batteries come in from Amazon, cuz I'm not going to a store, it's in an Amazon box.
[00:06:43] then I'm like, crap, I don't remember where I put this thing. So then I'll have the batteries out for a few days and then I'm like, put that over here and then that's stuffed over in a cubby somewhere and then I'll find the stupid device and then I don't remember what I did with the batteries.
[00:06:56] Yeah, that's, that's exactly what happened the other day. I was trying to [00:07:00] find AAA batteries and I text you and I was like, Hey, when you were at my house slash you didn't see AAA batteries.
[00:07:06] I tried to thank two. I'm like, no, I just, I remember seeing C one s at
[00:07:11] Yeah. And I needed the those, it was when I was trying to put new batteries in our fireplace remote.
[00:07:17] Yeah. I couldn't find the steam and I knew that I had a huge pack of AAA batteries and I did not want to buy more on Amazon because you buy them in bulk. And I put them like
[00:07:28] I know they're here.
[00:07:30] know. And I gave up, I put 'em in my cart and I almost checked out.
[00:07:35] And then I was like, let me check one more place. And there they were. And all was good in the world. Yeah.
[00:07:43] Yeah. I currently have five electric toothbrushes in my drawer in the bathroom because the battery will start dying. I'll forget about 'em. And then I'm at the store and I'll think, I won't remember. Oh, let me get new batteries, but I'll remember. Oh, I'll just get a new toothbrush
[00:07:57] I hate that with, like with my electric [00:08:00] toothbrush, I have to have new refills, like the new heads on them.
[00:08:03] Oh yeah.
[00:08:04] But I can never remember where I've put those stupid heads and like logically they're gonna be underneath my sink,
[00:08:10] They never are
[00:08:11] they're not there. I don't know what closet they're in. I don't know what room they're in.
[00:08:16] And like people who are listening are probably gonna be thinking these are hoarding people. But like we are, we're not hoarders. Our house isn't that bad.
[00:08:23] I don't need it, I throw it like I feel like we're good at oh, I ain't used this in a year. Unless it's of sentimental value. Toss it. We've moved so many times or nope.
[00:08:33] We're just not very good at making sure that something is exactly in this one spot that it logically should be and when we need
[00:08:39] I always blame future Josh and past Josh for a lot of things and on something like that I'll be like, God, what was past Josh thinking? Like when he opened this Amazon box of batteries. I know my mind. I'm like, oh, I'll put these here on top of the hutch in the living room so they don't get lost About a bing bada boom.
[00:08:59] [00:09:00] See, I
[00:09:00] do the same thing. I blame future Josh and past Josh for a lot of things too.
[00:09:06] I see how it is
[00:09:07] I'm like, where are those AAA batteries? Josh must have put them somewhere past Josh. Dang it.
[00:09:12] the hell you, what's funny is a lot of people always will get ahold of me and be like, Hey, do you remember last time you were at my house where this happened to be? And a lot of times I do
[00:09:24] I'm like, yes, actually it's on top of your fridge if in the kitchen, if you go in look under the plant.
[00:09:30] Right? Okay, so let's get back to your story. Go ahead.
[00:09:35] The Appalachian Mountains run north to south in the eastern third of the United States, passing through every coastal state, north of Florida and all the way up in into Canada. They range from 100 to 300 miles, 160 to 482 kilometers wide, and 1500 miles, 2,400 kilometers long. I included that because [00:10:00] we're like one of the only countries that use Miles
[00:10:03] we never actually got into the whole meters thing, but do you remember like when people started to try to do the meters thing, but like no one paid attention to it?
[00:10:10] Americans don't like change.
[00:10:12] not gonna do
[00:10:13] They also move slightly westward into other states, including Tennessee, Kentucky, Ohio, and West Virginia. So they're pretty darn big.
[00:10:24] I was watching something yesterday of English people reacting things in America. And one thing. I didn't realize is just how big our country is. Other countries, especially like England, they're so little, they can't fathom how big our country is.
[00:10:42] They're like, what do you mean you can drive for 14 hours and still not be at your destination? What do you mean?
[00:10:48] Fun fact, due to the high amounts of precipitation and wide array of flora and fauna, the Appalachian mountains are considered a temperate rainforest. I remember learning that.
[00:10:59] The last time we [00:11:00] all went to Tennessee together, one of the tour guides on something we were with mentioned it and I just, it stuck out to me cuz I'm like, I think of Rainforest, I think of the Amazon and I'm like, there's one a few hours from me.
[00:11:13] The mountains began to form around 480 million years ago and continued to grow around 200 million years as the super continent known as Panio was They are the oldest and the shortest mountains in the United States. They are short because they're with age mountains shrink on themselves.
[00:11:35] Native Americans first started settling the area close to 15,000 years ago, and the Cherokee are the largest tribe to remain in the Around the early 17 hundreds, European immigration started. This is where our ancestors came in. The Scottish, Irish and German settlers started to dwell in the mountains. They brought their own traditions from their [00:12:00] homelands and the melding of these cultures, along with Native American and African American has created unique music, art, and food culture, and fried potatoes and biscuits and gravy.
[00:12:14] You're welcome, I can literally make gravy out of anything. Challenge Oh I love it.
[00:12:24] Not that kind of fat.
[00:12:26] I am that kind of skinny. I used to make it for my best friend in high school. When her aunt Flo was visiting, she'd text me and be, or text to look. We didn't have that back then. She'd call the landline. She'd call the landline and ask for whoever answered for Josh,
[00:12:45] Some traditions other than biscuits and gravy that I can remember offhand are if your nose itches, it means that company's coming, hang a mirror by the door to keep away negative spirits. Never whistle in [00:13:00] the woods. It will attract things you might not want to you. And if you hear your name alone in the woods, no you didn't.
[00:13:07] Don't reply. Don't run and walk as fast as you can without running until you get home. Just to name a few along with a blending of cultures. The area known as Appalachia is filled with many possibly mythical creatures and beans and numerous mysterious disappearances. Some of the myths you might be familiar with, like bigfoot moth man, skin changers, and if you ever see a blue porch while you're in the south, it is to keep dark spirits called hates away.
[00:13:44] They think it's water and they can't cross water. They also like to count things so people will spill sand or other small things, and the ha has to count every single grain of sand before it's able to enter your house.
[00:13:59] [00:14:00] Wow.
[00:14:01] But there are so many more that aren't as well known, such as the Wus Beast, silver Giant, the Cherokee Death Cat, and Grims, who often like to hang out in cemeteries.
[00:14:16] For as long as humans have lived in them, there have been people that have mysteriously disappeared in the I am sure some just ran away. Others could have fallen off a mountain or into one of the numerous caves and dwellings that spread throughout the mountain chain. But with all the creatures said to dwell there, could it be possible that more than we think people have been taken or killed by them?
[00:14:45] After venturing too far off the we now travel back to the summer of 1969. Six year old Dennis Martin and his family were on their annual camping trip to the Smokey Mountains. [00:15:00] It was a tradition for the family and they were very familiar with the area. Starting their journey in Cade's Cove, which is my favorite place, I think in this entire world.
[00:15:12] They did manage to hike to Spence Field near the Appalachian Trail by the next day. That's around 22 miles with a six year Dennis was a kid who enjoyed scaring others, often by jumping out from behind something with a good boo. If you remember, I used to love hiding in closets and jumping out foreshadowing
[00:15:37] On the evening of June 14th, around four 30 in the evening. Dennis was last seen by his father playing with other children. He witnessed a son go behind a bush so that he would have a good spot to give jump scares to anyone who might pass Little did he know that would be the last time he would ever lay eyes on his son?[00:16:00]
[00:16:00] After about five short minutes and several missed scare opportunities, his father walked over to the bush to check on him. He got to the bush and his son was nowhere to He started to immediately look around, check all the other bushes, and ask others if they had seen where Dennis He then scoured the area and walked around close to two miles searching before returning to their camp and bringing in the help of park rangers.
[00:16:31] To make matters worse, shortly after dentist disappeared, heavy rain started and hindered all search efforts, temperatures even dropped to around 50 degrees Fahrenheit, 10 Celsius.
[00:16:45] The area is also known to be filled with ravines slopes and animals like black bears, bobcats, and feral hogs. To this day, it is still the largest search effort in the [00:17:00] history of the great Smokey Mountains National Park.
[00:17:03] Besides a child size footprint, a sock, and a small child's shoe, no other evidence has ever been found that could answer what happened to young Dennis Martin. While it is highly likely that a small child would wander off into the woods, the creatures that are believed to dwell in the mountains could have lured him into one of their many dens located in the cave system.
[00:17:30] Just below the. Some myths say that some of these creatures can, I'm getting goosebumps just talking about it. Sorry. . Some myths say that some of these creatures can know your name and will often call out to victims. They can even disguise their voices to mimic those of your loved ones. I know as a child, if I heard mom yelling for me to come here, I really didn't hesitate or we weren't allowed to.
[00:17:58] What do you want? [00:18:00] That was not allowed. You heard your name, you went to it. yeah, that was enough. Said. These creatures are predators and want something starts running. It does start their. This thing in their head where like all predators to pray prey runs, predators going to run after them and they can't help but to follow their instincts, to hunt down their prey.
[00:18:26] Even if you don't run, they can are still believed to be able to hypnotize you with their gaze. If you look into the trees and make eye contact, and this is what freaked me out, the worst, the farther away they sound, the closer they actually are to you. Like I was watching TikTok videos the other night and some of these myths and stuff, and when I heard that one it was like three in the morning and I'm like, okay, time to turn the light on.
[00:18:55] Like I'm a little, looks like I'm not sleeping. [00:19:00] Sometimes people go missing. Occasionally it's on their own efforts. Human error or caused by a wild animal. If you have ever been deep into nature, you'll know that the more beautiful something is, the more dangerous it tends to be.
[00:19:19] Some things in this world cannot be Could there be creatures living among us who remain hidden and just waiting for someone to look into the I think I'll play it safe and just not go into the woods after dark, and I will end with a simple reminder. Real monsters don't wear
[00:19:42] That's a good story, and it reminds me of how, my friend from Norway doesn't like trees,
[00:19:48] right? Oh,
[00:19:49] But of course in her part of Norway, in the north, they don't have But whenever she comes here, she's always terrified
[00:19:56] I never even thought like that would be no [00:20:00] wonder. Cuz my favorite thing to do is go hiking. Last time she was here no wonder she's no. You guys go on ahead. that would
[00:20:07] and she said that she doesn't like that you can't tell what's happening inside of things can hide.
[00:20:14] Easily too. If you've, even in movies, like something can be right there next to you and then you wouldn't even know because the trees,
[00:20:22] And we have been in Cades Cove, the part of the story that you're talking about. And we've seen a lot of bears and stuff and it's sometimes it's hard to even see them until you're actually on them because they're in the woods and everything camouflages within the woods.
[00:20:38] so quiet too. I remember the last time we went there, you guys had parked and let me go hiking for half an hour and it was beautiful and I was having a good time. But then I got creeped out at least with my brain when I'm alone in the woods too long, I start thinking like, what's watching me right now?
[00:20:55] First it's like squirrels and stuff, just little critters seed me and then I'm like, there [00:21:00] could be anything in here. The Appalachian Mountains, especially Cades Cove, are I think, in my opinion, one of the most beautiful things on our planet.
[00:21:08] And I'm a little bit obsessed with the myths and history, not only of the mountains, but of the people that have dwelled there. Cause Irish, Scottish, et cetera. Those are, that's pagan ancestry. So those have came over here and just how everything has a connection with those mountains in
[00:21:29] And that last line you said was that, was it monsters don't wear masks?
[00:21:33] Yes. Real monsters don't wear masks.
[00:21:35] And that brings me up to my topic, of course, which is gonna be more of a true crime mystery topic. And I say mystery, although because the person is in prison, the mystery behind it for me is just the fact that most people don't realize what actually happened. And even for those who think that they know a little bit about the story, may not know [00:22:00] the details.
[00:22:00] And I think it's important to know the details behind the actions to let that stuff out and into the air. So today my story is gonna be on Jared Fogel. And of course people may know the name Jared from Subway. And Josh, what do you know about
[00:22:17] Not a lot. Other than he was subway, spokesperson for years and years throughout my childhood.
[00:22:24] And then I know it was something to deal. An underage child. I'm not sure what the details are if it was just images or molestation or even worse, but I know he was found guilty and I remember did his wife divorce him while he was in jail or
[00:22:42] Yeah, she did. Yeah,
[00:22:44] I, that was like, and then he like had a letter come out, but I didn't even read the letter.
[00:22:50] yeah. What's weird about Jared is, first off, even for people like us who are Hoosiers, and for those of you who don't know, that's someone who's from Indiana. Jared is [00:23:00] also from Indiana,
[00:23:02] yeah, I know most people who are from Indiana do not know that, and.
[00:23:07] him now, for goodness sakes. No. Ohio,
[00:23:10] want to claim him anymore.
[00:23:11] But yeah, Jared is from Indiana. He was born here in 1977 and he's from the Indianapolis area. When he was young, he was only eight years old when his parents were divorced and his dad ended up leaving. And in an interview on Oprah, Jared talked about how when his dad left in order to fill the void, he filled it with food.
[00:23:33] And after that he started gaining a lot of weight. So from that moment on, from eight years old on. He started gaining a lot of weight and so by high school he was more than 300 pounds. So after high school he starts attending iu, which we know IU is in Bloomington, Indiana, which is in the southern portion of Indiana.
[00:23:56] Josh and I are in the northern portion, [00:24:00] but IU in Bloomington, that's the largest university in Indiana. But that's where Jared goes. And Jared was in very poor health because of how large he was, how much he weighed. What most people don't realize though, is the subway that most people know that he got his start in was actually connected to his dorm.
[00:24:19] They shared a wall, so it wasn't very far.
[00:24:21] Oh, shoot.
[00:24:22] Yeah, some people say that it was only about 10 steps, 10 steps to walk to the subway.
[00:24:31] I feel lied to. Like my, I thought like it was like, that was the whole, I lost weight cuz I walked miles and miles to go get my subway every day. Yeah. What lies
[00:24:42] Schemes, marketing schemes. But yeah, so it was on IU campus that the subway was at, and it was near his dorm. And so he would walk, to the subway after he moves into the dorm. And he would eat two subs a day, two sub sandwiches a day. And he called that [00:25:00] his subway diet.
[00:25:02] So within a year he said that he lost more than 100 pounds. So he continued that diet and eventually he would lose more than 200 pounds around that time. One of the franchise owners, hired him to do a marketing video.
[00:25:18] They actually went up to Chicago to shoot it. And in the marketing video, it was just supposed to be a regional ad for the Chicago, area. And it was gonna be sharing Jared's story about how he successfully lost all this weight from walking to Subway and eating these two sandwiches a day.
[00:25:38] And they were called the subway diet.
[00:25:41] And it was Jared's, story and everyone remembers from back then seeing his pants he wore, always had 'em
[00:25:51] remember grandma was
[00:25:52] like we went to Subway a lot when that came out. Like she was, I love Subway. Both grandmas
[00:25:58] And. [00:26:00] That marketing video was pretty successful in the regional area, and a lot of people saw it, and a lot of people went and started buying and it was so successful that it caught the eye of Subway as a whole, the whole company.
[00:26:20] Yeah. The corporate Subway wanted to get in on this marketing, so they ended up hiring Jared as their main spokesperson. So by the year 2000, Jared is their spokesperson, so we're all familiar with that part. We're familiar with him becoming the spokesperson for Subway, but things get a little weird eventually with the Subway thing, what most people don't know, which,
[00:26:46] is an important part in the story coming up, is that he doesn't actually become employed with Subway. The marketing side of Subway is actually held within a trust, and so [00:27:00] that trust is the one that he actually works for. So it's not the actual subways that own all the subway franchises, all that.
[00:27:09] It's a different company
[00:27:11] blame them, not us
[00:27:13] It's a, it is a separate entity.
[00:27:14] It matters later in the story when things start coming up into Jared's life. But the marketing that he did for Subway was extremely success. He would end up doing more than 300 commercials over his 15 years span at Subway, including making a lot of appearances and doing a lot of speeches and subway attributes.
[00:27:39] One third to one half of its growth to Jared with it's revenue having tripled from 1998 to
[00:27:50] Yeah. I don't feel like, isn't Subway America's number one fast food
[00:27:55] they would not be where, who they are. I like, just thinking back the [00:28:00] nineties and early two thousands, subway was like hu. It was everywhere.
[00:28:06] Yeah. And I think it's probably fair to say that without that marketing that Jared was a part of it probably wouldn't be where it is today. That's the unfortunate truth about all
[00:28:18] They'd still have old newspapers up on the wall for decoration.
[00:28:21] So in 1998, Jared met a man named John at a Weight Watchers
[00:28:27] He's doing both
[00:28:29] Yeah, I know. Isn't that seem like false advertising? Like they like show oh, he's losing weight because he is walking a subway and he's eating two subs
[00:28:38] lies upon lies.
[00:28:40] really, he's also doing Weight Watchers and doing all this stuff, so it's just a huge marketing
[00:28:46] probably got gastric bypass too.
[00:28:48] Who knows at this
[00:28:49] you too can lose weight by putting 24 inches of sandwich in your body a day.
[00:28:55] So he meets this man named John at Weight Watchers at a Weight Watchers meeting, [00:29:00] and John told Jared that he had been secretly videotaping himself having sex with underage girls. And he shows Jared some of the videos while Jared was fascinated by them. And he began to fantasize about having sex with underage girls himself.
[00:29:18] And so that's really the first time that we know of for right now, of the first time that Jared is introduced to this
[00:29:25] first off, what the hell? What is going on at these Weight Watchers meeting? Where that would even come up And Hey, are you counting your, your points? What's your points at, oh, by the way,
[00:29:35] Yeah. Hey, look at this video.
[00:29:37] And at what point in time do you find someone's comfort level with that? Can I talk about how I'm videotaping these people and doing these things with these underage, like
[00:29:46] I would've been like a tornado siren in that building. Woo. Look at everybody like a call the cops.
[00:29:55] please. right? Yeah. Some weird stuff was [00:30:00] happening at that Weight Watchers meeting. So a year later, Jared approaches a 16 year old girl working at Subway and asked her for sex. She agreed to let him masturbate in front of her for $50. She would later also share that she performed oral sex on him on two occasions for an additional $100. Yeah. And allegedly,
[00:30:30] get that tattooed
[00:30:31] Allegedly. The story goes that, that actually did get reported to Subways Corporate and it got all the way up to like their senior vice president, but somehow it didn't get any further than that and the story was squashed.
[00:30:48] It's, the old good old, oh, she's just a young girl looking for a quick buck. Like it ain't true. Don't believe her. Look over here.
[00:30:55] So nothing comes of that, nothing comes of that report.
[00:30:58] So after that Jared [00:31:00] begins to travel around the country soliciting sex from minors, he would often target homeless children or runaways because they were less likely to report it. And if you think about it, that actually makes a whole lot of sense on why predators would target people like that.
[00:31:18] And I know for people who would be listening to foul play, and we've had throwaway series and stuff like that where serial killers and other murderers target people who are runaways or people who are considered less than people, but for predators who are looking for sex from children. It makes a lot of sense for them to target that demo demographic as well.
[00:31:45] Because if they were to go to someone and report it, they probably wouldn't be believed. Even if they were to by for some reason, go report it. But they also aren't gonna be going to tell their parents,
[00:31:58] exactly, Hey, Jared [00:32:00] from Subway just fondled
[00:32:01] And the thing is if they're runaways, they probably don't know who he is. They're probably not watching tv.
[00:32:06] They're not keeping up with the
[00:32:08] not from a house that was sitting around getting subway,
[00:32:10] they're probably not going to Subway. And seeing those life size, do you remember those life size like punch out things that were of Jared and his big pants? Like I ever remember that. Yeah so that's that, that, so he starts doing that. He's going around the country soliciting sex for minors.
[00:32:24] Most of them are throwaways or homeless children. So in 2007, he meets a 17 year old girl at a New York City nightclub. He pays her $300 to have sex with him in a hotel room. . The girl also will later say that she saw child pornography on his laptop. Also the same year, 2007, Jared first seemingly came to the attention of the fbi and this happens after a journalist who had a radio show.
[00:32:55] Her name is Rochelle. She reports Jared to the [00:33:00] Sarasota Florida Police Department after a really weird encounter. So she ends up meeting Jared at a local middle school health event, and Jared was there speaking during one of these tours, and I believe this was the tour where he's going around talking about how much weight he's lost and doing his little pants tour,
[00:33:19] still skinny
[00:33:20] This is how much weight I've lost. You should do it too, where no one actually know. He's also, going to Weight Watchers going out and finding all these.
[00:33:29] probably on Slim Fast too, just trying 'em all.
[00:33:32] what all he's doing. He, Lord knows. Anyway, so she meets him and it's at this middle school health event.
[00:33:40] So I can't stress this enough. there's a Really weird encounter that plays out. So she starts making recordings of Jared after he started making these really weird comments about how he would find middle-aged school girls attractive.
[00:33:57] So Rochelle meets with the FBI [00:34:00] and agents and they asked her to continue to record and document any text messages or any of the contacts that she has Because they want all of that. He's on their radar now and they want all of this information. So she's gonna do this And this actually goes on for four years she is going to get all this information, she's gonna record it all. I can't even imagine, because she also has children. So she records all these conversations with him and he talks about how he has had and how he is having sex with underage girls.
[00:34:40] He asks her to install a webcam in her children's
[00:34:45] oh my God,
[00:34:46] so he could watch them. And in fact, he would be like, you can decide which child I watch.
[00:34:54] Oh my. I'm getting the
[00:34:55] freaking creep.
[00:34:57] my knife. Where's that at?
[00:34:58] So the fbi, [00:35:00] there's this really weird gray area when it comes to recording, and she's in Florida. And Florida State law requires that both parties know when someone is being recorded, whether it be on a phone or in person, whatever. So if you record someone on the phone, both people on that phone call need to know,
[00:35:20] chorus, Florida
[00:35:22] But federal law states that only one person needs to be aware. So there was a really strong gray area, and the FBI knew that. So they knew that they really needed a strong smoking gun if they were gonna go after Jared, and you have to think about what it's like in their shoes, especially if they're gonna go after a celebrity who has a lot of money and a lot of legal resources.
[00:35:47] Got that subway money.
[00:35:48] Yeah. And he's making Subway a lot of money and they may not want him to leave. And subway is probably gonna wanna make sure they don't look bad and they're gonna want to put some legal [00:36:00] stuff behind
[00:36:00] Jared. So I think the FBI was trying to really do their due diligence and try to get enough information to be able to make sure that whatever they could get on him was gonna stick and stick really strong
[00:36:11] So you, with a lot of men like him and those type of predators, you only get one chance. Cause after that he would've known, oh, they're onto me. I need to cover my self better.
[00:36:24] And then in 2008, so this would be about one year later, Jared starts texting a Subway franchise owner. Her name is Cindy Mills, and he was actually also having a sexual relationship with Cindy at that time. So that's a little murky,
[00:36:40] In the messages with Cindy, he talks about how he would sexually abused children ranging an age from nine to 16.
[00:36:49] Oh my God.
[00:36:50] And he told her that she should sell herself for sex on Craigslist.
[00:36:56] as one does
[00:36:56] And he also asked her to arrange for him to have [00:37:00] sex with her 16 year old cousin.
[00:37:03] Later she would say that she reported Jared to Subway's corporate management about the text messages,
[00:37:09] But she said that they responded that because Jared was not a Subway employee, there was no violation. Because again, I told you that Jared wasn't actually working for a Subway, the corporate company, he was working for this trust that was dealing with all of their marketing.
[00:37:25] So although it had shared a similar name for Subway and they were doing all the marketing for Subway, it was a different entity. It was a trust. So they had a different CEO and all this
[00:37:36] oh, this is shady. I swear I hate it.
[00:37:38] So she got an attorney and she tried to do a lot of work to try to seemingly get something done about Eventually none of that worked out though. Her last thing that she could do was contact the CEO of the trust that owns the marketing firm basically, that he's working for. So she contacts that [00:38:00] CEO and tells that CEO about all of And the ceo, and of course I'm gonna say the word allegedly, this is all
[00:38:10] But allegedly, the CEO says to her, look, please stop telling me all of this,
[00:38:16] I already know
[00:38:17] Please stop telling me all of this. Jared has recently started dating a teacher. And it looks like it's going well for him and we think that it's going to right all of the problems, and I don't wanna know anything more about this,
[00:38:36] and that's where that guy left it.
[00:38:39] Not my problem, basically.
[00:38:42] So at that time, I mentioned of course, that CEO mentioned that he was dating this girl and the girl that, that he mentions that Jared's dating. Her name is Kathleen. And this is a part of the story where it's [00:39:00] interesting because I believe that I actually met Jared and Kathleen.
[00:39:06] oh God,
[00:39:07] Yeah. You don't know this, do you? Yeah.
[00:39:10] I can't confirm if it was her that was with him, so it was near the end of 2008, maybe the beginning of 2009. When I was in Indianapolis for college freshman year and I was working at Traders Point Show Place 12, the movie theater.
[00:39:29] And we it's a really nice part of Indianapolis. We would have really, fancy sports cars parked out in front. That was my first time seeing any fancy sports car in my
[00:39:43] you don't have to say fancy, it's, see, isn't
[00:39:45] But that was like, it's just a really nice area of Indianapolis. And the theater would attract very wealthy individuals a lot.
[00:39:55] So we would get people who, were players for the Colts.[00:40:00]
[00:40:00] oh yeah,
[00:40:01] And the thing is though, is I never knew who these people were. I never had watched television.
[00:40:06] play what sport. Oh, good for you buddy. Go along.
[00:40:09] I didn't watch sports. So like one time Peyton Manning and another guy, another football player comes in and I was working at the box office.
[00:40:20] I sell them their ticket. I had no idea who
[00:40:22] wouldn't have either
[00:40:23] Yeah, no idea. I noticed that they were really big guys. Big guys,
[00:40:28] you guys work out
[00:40:29] And they go on and some of the other employee was like, oh my God, do you know who that was? And I was like, no. And they're like, it's Peyton Manning. And I was like, Who's Peyton Manning?
[00:40:40] I'm didn't hit
[00:40:42] And they're like, you have to be joking right now. And I was like, no I don't know who that is. Is that an attorney or something? I don't know. And they're like he plays for the Cols. And the other guy was like, I don't know, some other position that was important. I don't know if there's not any non-important positions, but the other guy [00:41:00] was a decent, important position.
[00:41:02] all I know football is the pants look nice on the Fells
[00:41:07] But so yeah. So I had no idea who those guys were, but we would have people like that in a lot. And most of the time I had no idea who these people were. One day this guy comes in, it was a pretty busy night, and he approaches me at the box office and he was with a younger looking girl, quite younger looking girl.
[00:41:27] I remember that. And. The guy asked for, whatever movie he was watching and I just treated everyone the same, basically, hi, how you know, how can I help you? And he immediately was taken aback for some reason that I wasn't treating him extra special
[00:41:44] I could give two turd about you,
[00:41:47] he goes, excuse me, do you know who I am?
[00:41:51] And I
[00:41:51] looked up and my first thought was, oh, he might be an employee or something. Because if they're an [00:42:00] employee they can watch movies for free and they can just sign
[00:42:03] are you a StubHub member,
[00:42:05] I go, oh, I'm sorry. Do you work here? Cuz I hadn't been working there for very long. And he looked at me and I thought like he was
[00:42:11] the audacity,
[00:42:13] And he goes, no, I don't work here. And I was like, oh, I'm sorry. And he goes, I'm Jared from Subway. And my second thought was, Oh, he must work at a local subway because I know that like for lunches and stuff, like some of the local employees would go out to lunches. There was this pizza place called Monocles across the street from the theater that local employees would go to and they'd befriend the employees there.
[00:42:40] So that's who I thought this guy was just a worker
[00:42:43] mind? Waiter
[00:42:45] manager at Subway or something. And so I was like, oh, do you work at the subway in the neighborhood? And then he just gave me this look no, I'm their spokesperson. And I was
[00:42:56] Good for you. What movie you here to see? Good lord.
[00:42:58] That's exactly what
[00:42:59] you [00:43:00] have to tell somebody,
[00:43:01] Here's your ticket. Your theater's number 11 on your left. Have a good day. And it was just this really awkward exchange. And I think what made him the most upset in all honesty, is, in my impression of it, was that he was on this date with this young girl,
[00:43:17] to impress
[00:43:18] he was wanting to, and he's, he was probably so used to people like being, oh my gosh, jar from Subway.
[00:43:25] And I didn't know who this guy was and like, not my fault, I didn't know who he
[00:43:29] He's not really special, he looks like any other guy,
[00:43:32] And I'm surprised you didn't whip out the pants. I'm Jared, don't you remember?
[00:43:36] him in my
[00:43:37] Right, He was upset and he ends up walking away like steaming, walking away. And this other girl that I work with comes up and she goes first of all, I love that you did not know who he was.
[00:43:48] And she goes, I think he was really mad at you. And I was like, I know, I thought that he was gonna ask to speak to my manager
[00:43:54] oh my God,
[00:43:55] And she's like, you didn't do anything wrong. I was
[00:43:58] doesn't know who I
[00:43:58] I know. But I think I [00:44:00] just like really deflated his ego.
[00:44:02] Like he was trying to impress this girl who he was trying to, go to the theater with and oh, I'm
[00:44:08] I'm a celebrity.
[00:44:09] And that's exactly that. So that was my meeting Jared.
[00:44:12] I I vaguely remember you
[00:44:14] Yeah. I told you about it back then.
[00:44:16] think I met Jared from some point, but I didn't know who he was.
[00:44:20] like during the theater, like I, I tried to make sure that he wouldn't be able to find me cuz I was a little like nervous that he like, cause he was mad.
[00:44:27] Come out of the movie like, do you know who I am
[00:44:29] I would've went and got Subway.
[00:44:32] I would've went and got Subway and been right out there eating it when he got out of the theater.
[00:44:36] sir. I, I love Subway,
[00:44:38] I dunno who the hell you are.
[00:44:40] right? So that was me meeting Jared and my impression
[00:44:44] not a good one.
[00:44:46] Right. But whether it was his wife, who knows.
[00:44:49] I bet he's sitting in his cell, to this day with all his free time. But like that one time in Indiana and that guy didn't know who I was. It still bothers me.
[00:44:56] But it, and it may not have been his wife or his [00:45:00] future wife, I guess won't ever know because he did, have a lot of these relationships with a lot of underage girls, unfortunately. So it's really hard telling if it was his wife and I think his wife and his children were unfortunate
[00:45:14] right? They weren't aware of this. And just to put this out there, young girls, if an older man is attracted to you and hitting on you and trying to get you to go out with them, think to yourself why does no woman his age want anything to do with them?
[00:45:29] Because they know better.
[00:45:30] So Kathleen, they actually met in 2000 through his brother. She was 24 when they met, and she was two years younger than him. So in November, 2009, they got engaged and they ended up getting married a year later. And actually, Kathleen was his second wife.
[00:45:50] All of this stays out of the public life Until 2015 when something very important starts happening. Jared's business partner, [00:46:00] Russell Taylor, his house gets raided by the fbi, and when they raid his home, they discover that Russell had been trading child porn photos and videos.
[00:46:13] So they find that some of the children were as young as six years old
[00:46:18] and he had been trading them with Jared. So he'd been handing all that stuff over to Jared.
[00:46:24] And what's weird about that scenario that plays out is Russell ends up getting caught because, he's friends with a couple and the couple's husband dies and she's left as a widow and Russell starts messaging her these weird text messages and they just get weirder and weirder over time. And they start out as, I wanna say innocent, but they're just weird. They're just like, we should do this, we should do that.
[00:46:52] And then he'd be like, Hey, I'm gonna is it okay if I start, if I use your house this weekend to meet up with [00:47:00] people? So he would like want to use her house for weird things,
[00:47:03] no ? Hell
[00:47:05] and at one point he wants to use her house for a bestiality
[00:47:09] What the hell we're, why? Okay. First off, someone tells me, like these other two women oh, hey, can I film your child or will you film your child for me? Or, can I have your house to have sex with animals or whatnot? Why are these like, he would not have testicles. I'm like, I'm a go get the knife. And the everything.
[00:47:30] And she seemingly in everything that she has shared, like never.
[00:47:34] Reciprocated his advances or, did anything
[00:47:38] new who this.
[00:47:40] And so she just, is just Hey, that's not okay, da. But he would just continue to do it. And then he would talk about in those text messages, like his fantasies,
[00:47:50] and then he started like sharing photos of child, like child porn photos.
[00:47:57] And some of the actual [00:48:00] videos and photos were people that he knew and were like secret videos that he recorded of children from Yeah, from footage that he captured by putting in secret cameras in clocks
[00:48:17] Oh my. I just saw an article the other day about all the different types of hidden camera devices, like iPhone chargers, even in public bathrooms.
[00:48:25] They have some that look like the little thing that sprays out air freshener, but it's a Jesus.
[00:48:32] Russell was all into that stuff and so he was collecting all this child porn and giving it and sharing it with Jared. It was just this whole thing. And Russell was, of course, Jared's business partner, but they shared the Jared Foundation, which was supposed to be this foundation that they had that, Jared founded.
[00:48:52] Wasn't that the helped kids
[00:48:54] It was to help kids with childhood obesity. But they later find out that none of that money [00:49:00] actually went to anything good. And it was actually just to pay for the executives
[00:49:06] the only exercise the kids got was running away from Jared.
[00:49:09] So the thing is though, is that, that through that investigation, they were able to link the video and footage being sent to from Russell's computer to Jared's so they would have a record of incoming to Jared's computer
[00:49:25] he was on the forward
[00:49:27] right? Yeah. So they were, they had the record and they were able to Then on July 7th, 2015, the FBI and the Indiana State Police, they raided Jared's Zionsville home and they arrest him on child pornography charges. And that's when they went and got his computer, a bunch of other electrical devices.
[00:49:50] All of it, they found, child porn throughout all of.
[00:49:55] And a spokesperson on that day for Subway said that the company [00:50:00] and Jared had mutually agreed to suspend their business relationship.
[00:50:04] Mm. Well He technically wasn't even working for us. It was this other company
[00:50:09] Isn't that funny?
[00:50:10] who put him in that commercial
[00:50:11] So Subway immediately wipes Jared from their website.
[00:50:16] Oh yeah. We don't want nothing to do with that.
[00:50:19] it, it's almost like they have this button that they've had for a while and all they needed was like the one event that happens and they can get as much money from the commercials up until that point, and then they can push a button and they can just separate themselves from Jared and erase him from their websites.
[00:50:35] They knew like he was up to this stuff. Even like this other company that wasn't Subway that he worked for knew.
[00:50:42] Oh, allegedly that all this stuff was coming up to them.
[00:50:44] they had a backup like as soon as this comes out in the news, Nope.
[00:50:48] And yeah, it's just crazy to me that, but again, when Jared's making them all this money, money is important to people and We know that. On August [00:51:00] 19th, 2015, a plea deal was arranged with Jared and he pleads guilty to two counts.
[00:51:06] One was for the distribution and receipt of child pornography and one for traveling to engage in illicit sexual conduct with a minor. He's ordered to pay $1.4 million in restitution and receives 15 years and eight months in prison. Now the judge said after all this, the judge states that the level of perversion and lawlessness exhibited by Mr.
[00:51:34] Fogel is extreme. But there was a statement that caused a lot of controversy that one of the psychologists talked about when they were referring to, and I believe the psychologist was called as a part of the defense And the psychologist was talking about, they were blaming Jared's weight loss and his eating disorder for his pedophilia [00:52:00] and
[00:52:01] And the psychologist used the words, and I quote that Jared had mild or weak pedophilia. And that received a lot of criticism because even later in the trial when other psychologists would come up and talk, they would criticize that and they would say there was nothing mild or weak about what he was doing to
[00:52:28] that was pretty damn
[00:52:31] I tried to look at finding any type of defense because the, that psychologist never spoke out and defended his statements. maybe He was hired to try to minimize what happened. Maybe that was the the only caveat that I could find maybe was there was one statement that another psychologist mentioned that it's possible that what he meant was mild or weak [00:53:00] pedophilia could have been a reference to the age of pedophilia that he was targeting was not as young as it could have been.
[00:53:10] But again, some of the porn that he had was up to like age six. So like how mild or how weak are we talking?
[00:53:18] Where the hell are those coming? What my mind is thinking of now is like someone who thinks of himself as a celebrity and with his finances, he's just one cog and a huge poy and he took the fall for all those people were, who are sending him and taking these videos, but he's the only one got anything.
[00:53:42] There's all those men are still out there taking these videos and filming I also think of those poor victims like the Runaways, those people, like I was just sitting over here thinking this person, this child has ran away from home. They literally have no body as a comfort to [00:54:00] and in order to survive they're having to let this Jared from Subway use their body to pleasure
[00:54:09] right? Even that girl that was working at Subway who I mentioned,
[00:54:13] The 16 year old
[00:54:14] yeah. Who was letting him masturbate in front of her for $50 and said that she gave him oral sex two times, $400
[00:54:24] Like that's disgusting that, that she had to resort to that. But it happens. But I think that ultimately, he was the party of disgust.
[00:54:34] But I think the moral of the story for me, knowing all of this, is just that there was an institution that I think was making a lot of money, and
[00:54:45] seemed to be aware, at least to some
[00:54:47] at least there's a lot of accusations that people were reporting it and that he was such a bad. A predator that, that it's just hard to believe that people would just stay [00:55:00] quiet and not be reporting it.
[00:55:02] It's just hard for me to fathom that no one would have received a word for it. But then again, like Subway was making so much money off of
[00:55:12] To for him to be responsible for half their growth, like between those years, like that's a massive amount of money that Subway was
[00:55:22] And they did not wanna
[00:55:23] and they didn't wanna stop it.
[00:55:25] And it wasn't until after they stopped the ads that Jared was doing, that's when the $5 foot long ads started. So that's when our memory switches from the Jared ads to the $5 foot long And I think maybe for Subway, they were trying to hurry up and find the next thing because they needed something because suddenly their spokesperson was in a horrible situation. So it was fight or fly,
[00:55:50] gotta do something to get these sandwiches to these people. You
[00:55:53] or fly, right? Yeah. Fight or fly. I don't even know what I said
[00:55:58] good heavens.
[00:55:59] [00:56:00] Yeah. But he is shady. But yeah. You mentioned that he did write a letter. Yeah, he, so in prison he ends up writing a letter and it's the only communication that people have received about what life has been like for him in prison. And all that he says in it basically is that he messed up. And he doesn't take ownership for his actions, but he also talks about how much weight he's lost and that he's constantly working out
[00:56:28] We hope you gain a back.
[00:56:29] We don't care. How you lost weight? Not from Subway. We don't, we're gonna walk 10 miles to the prison every day for lunch. No, we don't.
[00:56:37] Yeah. But he will be, able to get out of prison. And when he gets released, he will still be a millionaire.
[00:56:44] Even after he paid off the settlement from the divorce and after the legal fees. Yeah. He's still worth plenty of money, so he'll still be, he'll still have money when he gets out.
[00:56:54] surgery so you don't look like Jared from Subway anymore.
[00:56:58] Yeah, I'm sure he'll, write a [00:57:00] book and he'll try to profit on, the same type of scheme that he tried to play prior.
[00:57:05] Oh yeah.
[00:57:07] So Jared gets out of prison on March 24th, 2029, so not much longer. So we'll find out what's next for him. I'm sure he's gonna try to spin it. As he was a victim of some kind and he'll try to make more money off
[00:57:23] Oh yeah, I'm sorry. I got caught. Not sorry for what I actually
[00:57:27] Yeah, that's when I read the letter. That's exactly what my impression of it was. He didn't mention that he was sorry. He didn't mention about the victims that he apologizes for them.
[00:57:36] See, to me like in my brain, I bet this has ties with some of Epstein's people, like that whole pedophilia island.
[00:57:44] And then I bet he, I'm, I have no proof of this but I bet he's one of those people that believe that pedophilia is a sexual identity, like me being gay, like they have no choice over this. And for people to condemn them [00:58:00] for this natural reaction in their body is wrong. There's a whole group of mostly men.
[00:58:07] I, I've not heard of any women, but I ain't counting it out, but they have conventions and everything. Like they have a whole ideology that this is our sexual orientation and how dare you tell us that this is wrong.
[00:58:21] they're trying to normalize
[00:58:22] Yeah. Pretty much saying. To be a pedophile is no different than being gay, lesbian, transgender, et cetera.
[00:58:28] It's something that's inside of them that they cannot help. And I think you should just be castrated if that's your mentality. Sorry, not sorry. You don't get to have that. Nope.
[00:58:40] Or an internet access. Here's a Nok 97. That's all the phone you get.
[00:58:46] Yeah. I feel like he should get his internet card revoked. Like we trusted you with that. Like back then
[00:58:52] Can you imagine walking in when he gets out, walking in the Best Buy to buy a, if I was that retail worker, I like Uhuh. You ain't uhuh, [00:59:00] you can, here's a piece of paper and a pen. Don't even, I don't wanna see a doodle and nothing
[00:59:05] and now I feel like, especially compared to back then, I hope that maybe child porn is easily more traceable. So if he does get out and that becomes a problem again, hopefully, he'll be
[00:59:19] Watched closely,
[00:59:20] bit better. But there is no, option for parole or anything. So that's positive at least.
[00:59:26] So he's not gonna be able to get out until that date
[00:59:29] And I hate too, that he really didn't get busted or in trouble for actually having sex with minors. Like it was for having the traveling to have sexual activity and having the images.
[00:59:46] But all those runaways and underage children that he was having sexual relationships with, he didn't get in trouble for that.
[00:59:54] You know what's also weird to me is that Jared received 15 years in prison, [01:00:00] but his business partner received 27 So , you can't tell me that the system doesn't favor some certain type of people.
[01:00:09] Jared probably had a better lawyer than
[01:00:11] Oh, I'm sure. But I also like, like just the fact that, there's just a huge discrepancy in those years and that Jared benefited from all of that and that guy worked for Jared.
[01:00:23] Like it just come on now. It just sounds like there was, it was more than just him receiving videos and Jared had no idea what that man was doing or how he received those videos.
[01:00:32] That's just how they played it off. It was him, not me, him, this guy, you guys don't know.
[01:00:38] But in my mind, I think Jared probably should have gotten much more than what even Russell
[01:00:44] Oh yeah.
[01:00:45] what he was doing seems much worse to
[01:00:48] You were actively praying upon underage children at truck stops, et cetera, and.
[01:00:55] his position
[01:00:56] Forcing yourself through fame, [01:01:00] notoriety, or just physical brute force,
[01:01:01] if you were a victim of Jared, I am sorry and I hope that you have found some healing within yourself or with help from therapy or whatever it may be.
[01:01:14] I hope you have been able to find healing from him being arrested.
[01:01:19] And I also think that it's important that we also highlight that there was people who spoke out against a celebrity with a lot of money.
[01:01:26] That doesn't always turn out the best for people. They get, even with evidence, their fans will threaten them
[01:01:34] Not only did Rochelle speak out and, work with the FBI and did all of that for those recordings, some, of his victims had spoken now and reported unfortunately nothing seemed to have come of it. But at least there was some type of trace of that stuff being documented in some way, shape, or form.
[01:01:54] So we can know what happened and when it happened and we can talk about
[01:01:57] oh have mercy. See this . [01:02:00] There is a reason I never dove into the Jared from Subway story cause it was one of those like underage child. I don't need to know more. He's in jail. Good. That's all I
[01:02:11] In my opinion, I think that his hope and probably the hope of the people who he has worked for is that people only ever know
[01:02:22] The minimum amount of information that Jared had child porn on his computer.
[01:02:27] Not the details of it, because the details of it make it so much more
[01:02:32] That's all that was. He had images on his computer. That's, I had no idea he was going out meeting runaways at truck stops
[01:02:40] Or that an organization was allegedly trying to help harbor and hide pedophile.
[01:02:47] I, that one guy that don't tell me more. He's got a girlfriend now. Don't tell me more. I don't care if he's got two girlfriends. He's got under a no, I'm gonna be outside your office every day. [01:03:00] Let me in
[01:03:00] Good lord.
[01:03:02] All right, we can end it there. Did you have an exit written?
[01:03:05] I didn't, cuz I didn't know honestly.
[01:03:08] Look at you
[01:03:08] but yeah. If you enjoyed our new podcast, mystery Incorporated, please go listen to one of our other podcasts that we host.
[01:03:18] I am the host of Rotten to the Core and Shane is the host of Hometown History Foul Play. I can't remember
[01:03:27] two host
[01:03:28] Okay, well If you enjoyed this podcast, please follow us on one of our other ones and give us a listen. We enjoy communicating, I guess